Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

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SpottedShroom
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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by SpottedShroom » May 13th, 2014, 3:25 pm

lilwoofer wrote: Mac OS X 10.6.8
While I don't think it's related to your problem, I would point out that officially, the game is only supported on Mac OS 10.7+.

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by MyGameCompany » May 13th, 2014, 7:44 pm

For the record, it does run on my 10.5.8 machine. And except for the program icon not showing up, it runs fine for me with no problems.
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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by lilwoofer » May 13th, 2014, 9:55 pm

xolotl wrote:I actually wonder if your machine could be overheating. The rain animations probably put more strain on the graphics card, and maybe Book III is simply "heavier" in that respect..

What other games work okay? Eschalon does take up a nontrivial amount of CPU, it'd be nice to know what else that's graphic-heavy actually works okay.
First off, I am the LAST person anyone should talk to about what goes on inside computers!!! I dust out the inside once a month but other than that, I cannot recall even how I installed the RAM 8 years ago!

Actually, I do not have any RPG games on my computer except for E1,2 and 3. I do have VERY simplistic games like Virtual Villagers, Mystery Case Files, Twisted Lands. I tried Civilization 4 ( no issues that I recall) but was really bored with that. See? Very simple games, so yeah, my computer was originally bought for graphic designing not graphics games. I stumbled upon BG by chance when looking for RPG games for the Mac many moons ago when E1 first came out. Since then, I have been hooked only on this series as I have found no others that keep my ADHD in check and my brain highly impressed.

I guess the biggest issue/concern I have is, are the sparkly lined artifacts on my monitor signs of a monitor going bad, or just relics as they go away once I turn off or put the computer to sleep. And since the computer freezes completely, is force powering off the computer (up to ten times a day with this version of Eschalon) really as bad as I have heard?

And SS, i know, you guys are exempt from any accusations and I know what is recommended by y'all. But I have no more funds to buy a new computer and my $8000 paperweight does fine on everything else. Sadly, Apple does not want to upgrade my computer at all any more.

and still and yet, the only issue I had with either 1 and 2 of Eschalon was the funky graphics like snow white triangles on the ground. Nothing as drastic as crashing my computer completely. I guess, I will go the way of the dodo. Can't get new computer so maybe best to just get off the grid.

But I do thank all of you for your replies (MGC who has GREAT mods!), suggestions (x) and warnings (SS)
I will stay an initiate, please,let the officers, lieutenants, etc. do the brain work, I will be the grunt! GRRRR-Unt!

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by xolotl » May 13th, 2014, 10:10 pm

lilwoofer wrote: First off, I am the LAST person anyone should talk to about what goes on inside computers!!! I dust out the inside once a month but other than that, I cannot recall even how I installed the RAM 8 years ago!
You should be able to find some software to monitor your temperature; a google for "osx temperature monitor" yields this link as the first hit, for instance: http://www.bresink.com/osx/TemperatureMonitor.html (Disclaimer: I don't run OSX, and I've never actually used that software, so I can't vouch for how well it works, etc.)

I'd recommend turning that on and then seeing how the various Eschalon games compare in terms of heat. It could be that it's not actually a problem, but it'd be good to know. If you've been dusting it out once a month then heat is probably a little less likely, but it's possible.
I guess the biggest issue/concern I have is, are the sparkly lined artifacts on my monitor signs of a monitor going bad, or just relics as they go away once I turn off or put the computer to sleep. And since the computer freezes completely, is force powering off the computer (up to ten times a day with this version of Eschalon) really as bad as I have heard?
Both of those are certainly Bad Things which shouldn't be happening. In the latter case (the hard lockups), no userspace application like Eschalon should be able to totally freeze a computer like that. The main culprits for that, especially in the gaming universe, are either 1) driver issues or 2) heat problems. Heat problems would be slightly easier to rule out with a monitor, 'cause you can just watch and see what it's doing

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by mbrowne » May 13th, 2014, 11:40 pm

It sounds to me like your gfx card may be going. Can you run diagnostics on it?

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by lilwoofer » May 14th, 2014, 10:54 am

Whoa! NOW I am getting scurred!!! Like Ursher. I will follow up on the link, thanks xolotl (what does that stand for anyway?) Thanks for the link. And if it is my graphix card, then I am screwed as THAT costs mucho more-o money than I can afford at this time. Dang guys, for this problematic computer and user, you guys rule! And i have NO idea how to run diagnostics on a graphics card, though utilities Manager tells me everything is fine on my end.... Hmmmm.
I will stay an initiate, please,let the officers, lieutenants, etc. do the brain work, I will be the grunt! GRRRR-Unt!

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by xolotl » May 14th, 2014, 11:00 am

lilwoofer wrote:I will follow up on the link, thanks xolotl (what does that stand for anyway?)
No problem, good luck. "Xolotl" is a pretty presumptuous handle, actually: it's an Aztec god of lightning and death. In the end I'd have preferred to use a fully-unique name, but I've got this name in a number of places now, and it's generally more work than it's worth to change. :)

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by lilwoofer » May 25th, 2014, 6:01 pm

By the way, in my confusion of the freezing computer, i neglected to note another "bug" In EI and II, Charm Flask took 1 Mellowleaf, 1 Ambergris to create 1 Charm Flask. NOW, it creates MULTIPLE Flasks... Bug or a gimme? I created a LOT of money just by collecting those herbs, mixing and selling the flasks, usually on an average of 10 flasks per mix.
I will stay an initiate, please,let the officers, lieutenants, etc. do the brain work, I will be the grunt! GRRRR-Unt!

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by SpottedShroom » May 26th, 2014, 11:11 am

lilwoofer wrote:By the way, in my confusion of the freezing computer, i neglected to note another "bug" In EI and II, Charm Flask took 1 Mellowleaf, 1 Ambergris to create 1 Charm Flask. NOW, it creates MULTIPLE Flasks... Bug or a gimme? I created a LOT of money just by collecting those herbs, mixing and selling the flasks, usually on an average of 10 flasks per mix.
Interesting! I did some testing, and it looks like three recipes are affected: Charm Cloud, Toxic Aura, and Demon Oil. You get around between 8 and 16 doses of Charm Cloud, between 8 and 11 of Toxic Aura, and 1 or 2 of Demon Oil. I would believe that the Demon Oil thing is a intentional change to make thrown combat specialists easier to play, but the other two seem too good.

I also noticed some other minor alchemy weirdness. When clicking a recipe name in your book to auto-move reagents into the mixer, items you don't have enough Intelligence/Lore to identify on your own get changed back to Unknown. The same thing also happens when you close the Alchemy mixer with items still in it. And clicking a recipe name will select Unknown items of the correct type for the recipe.

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by lilwoofer » June 11th, 2014, 9:39 pm

AND it would have been nice if they left it the way it was in EII where ALL parts were loaded into the mixer. One has to load a flask every time in this version. Not a big thing, mind you, but still, when something works well why fix it???
I will stay an initiate, please,let the officers, lieutenants, etc. do the brain work, I will be the grunt! GRRRR-Unt!

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by Nysyarc » June 25th, 2014, 4:40 pm

I have an odd and somewhat exploitable bug to report. In the Akadai Underworld, I am somehow able to spawn a (so far) unlimited number of loot bags each containing a single Fetid Grubb Tumor by simply saving and reloading my game. Each time I save and reload, another loot bag appears. I had saved to take a break when I got to a pair of Sentinel Stalks, and when I reloaded a loot bag appeared that I thought had definitely not been there before. I reloaded the file again to see if it was a one-time thing, but the loot bag generated again. I saved with the loot bag present and loaded the new file, and a second loot bag spawned.

Here are a few screen shots of my situation, I can also do a screen recording of me saving and reloading to spawn them if further verification is needed:

http://imgur.com/D2knvvO - Initially, I'd already saved and reloaded several times.
http://imgur.com/OFXWFBt - After saving and reloading a few more times.
http://imgur.com/Na9xcRy - After saving and reloading many times.

Obviously this would be a very slow method of achieving unlimited gold, but it would theoretically be possible. In the process of doing this I also discovered (as you can tell based on the amount of Mana I have in the screenshots, my recovery rate is 1 per turn) that a single turn passes when you save and reload a file, and enemies will not attack during this turn, allowing you to recharge Mana and possibly Hit Points for free as long as you haven't activated the game rule preventing you from saving in combat. This may have already been known, I just realized it while testing this other bug.

Some notes about the bug:

- It seems that it probably follows me wherever I go in the Akadai Underworld, more loot bags spawned near me when I tested the turn passing while fighting an enemy: http://imgur.com/qUBFtix
- I am running the latest version of the game on Mac OSX 10.6.8.

I'm keeping a save file separate in this area in case anyone wants me to do further testing or record a video or something. I'm also keeping a file from before I entered the Underworld for the first time, so I can try to reproduce the bug later.

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by Randomizer » June 25th, 2014, 7:46 pm

SpottedShroom wrote:Interesting! I did some testing, and it looks like three recipes are affected: Charm Cloud, Toxic Aura, and Demon Oil. You get around between 8 and 16 doses of Charm Cloud, between 8 and 11 of Toxic Aura, and 1 or 2 of Demon Oil. I would believe that the Demon Oil thing is a intentional change to make thrown combat specialists easier to play, but the other two seem too good.
I tested Demon Oil and there are two variables. A random number at a fixed Alchemy level and an increase as Alchemy level increases until the level for the next higher type of Demon Oil.

The last beta before release had more vials of Demon Oil made similar to what you see for Charm Cloud and Toxic Aura. So this probably wasn't fixed when Demon Oil was changed.

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by SpottedShroom » June 26th, 2014, 4:58 pm

Nysyarc wrote:I have an odd and somewhat exploitable bug to report. In the Akadai Underworld, I am somehow able to spawn a (so far) unlimited number of loot bags each containing a single Fetid Grubb Tumor by simply saving and reloading my game.
This is related to the fix a bug where you could get stuck in the Akadai Underworld if you went back after killing the grubbs. Whenever you return to that map after the first time, the game calls "cond_not_item (Fetid Grubb Tumor) ; drop_item (Fetid Grubb Tumor) 100". So if you aren't holding a tumor, it drops one for you. But if you just leave the bags on the ground, they keep piling up.

It's a fairly minor exploit, but it's probably a bigger deal that you can do this immediately as soon as you enter the map, which lets you leave without completing the dungeon.

I would suggest as a fix dropping the map return script entirely, and replacing it with an area trigger near the Crux that spawns a grubb on the path back to the main area of the dungeon.

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by IJBall » June 30th, 2014, 12:02 pm

SpottedShroom wrote:
Nysyarc wrote:I have an odd and somewhat exploitable bug to report. In the Akadai Underworld, I am somehow able to spawn a (so far) unlimited number of loot bags each containing a single Fetid Grubb Tumor by simply saving and reloading my game.
This is related to the fix a bug where you could get stuck in the Akadai Underworld if you went back after killing the grubbs. Whenever you return to that map after the first time, the game calls "cond_not_item (Fetid Grubb Tumor) ; drop_item (Fetid Grubb Tumor) 100". So if you aren't holding a tumor, it drops one for you. But if you just leave the bags on the ground, they keep piling up.

It's a fairly minor exploit, but it's probably a bigger deal that you can do this immediately as soon as you enter the map, which lets you leave without completing the dungeon.

I would suggest as a fix dropping the map return script entirely, and replacing it with an area trigger near the Crux that spawns a grubb on the path back to the main area of the dungeon.
Honestly, this "bug" is so small that it's probably not even worth BW's time.
There are a number of other "bugs" in your list that I'd much rather see fixed...

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Re: Semi-official bug tracking thread (SPOILERS)

Post by SpottedShroom » June 30th, 2014, 12:51 pm

IJBall wrote: Honestly, this "bug" is so small that it's probably not even worth BW's time.
There are a number of other "bugs" in your list that I'd much rather see fixed...
Well, sure. There are plenty of bugs in the list that I don't think are worth fixing, but it's probably still a good idea to document them.

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