Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
So I've been thinking about how the True Healer challenge works, in relation to killing Sparrow and all, and I've been thinking that it'd be great if there were some way to get that key off of her without having to break True Healer (and yeah, I know that there are other ways into Hammerlorne anyway). How about a Pickpocketing skill for Thief-type characters? Though of course Thieves would have perhaps the easiest time getting into Hammerlorne without Sparrow's key, anyway.
I imagine it would only work when NPCs aren't aware of you (have to sneak up from behind, etc), and it'd be pretty cool to have many other NPCs have pickpocketable loot as well. I imagine that mostly it'd just be small amounts of gold, but occasionally having other items come up would be fun too (perhaps extra keys for chests they store in their house, etc).
I imagine it would only work when NPCs aren't aware of you (have to sneak up from behind, etc), and it'd be pretty cool to have many other NPCs have pickpocketable loot as well. I imagine that mostly it'd just be small amounts of gold, but occasionally having other items come up would be fun too (perhaps extra keys for chests they store in their house, etc).
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Like the magic amulet that lets the smiths walk through walls to get to their treasure.xolotl wrote:So I've been thinking about how the True Healer challenge works, in relation to killing Sparrow and all, and I've been thinking that it'd be great if there were some way to get that key off of her without having to break True Healer (and yeah, I know that there are other ways into Hammerlorne anyway). How about a Pickpocketing skill for Thief-type characters? Though of course Thieves would have perhaps the easiest time getting into Hammerlorne without Sparrow's key, anyway.
I imagine it would only work when NPCs aren't aware of you (have to sneak up from behind, etc), and it'd be pretty cool to have many other NPCs have pickpocketable loot as well. I imagine that mostly it'd just be small amounts of gold, but occasionally having other items come up would be fun too (perhaps extra keys for chests they store in their house, etc).
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Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Heh - perhaps they don't even know that those chests are there - built into the walls by the previous owners of the building or something. :)Kreador Freeaxe wrote:Like the magic amulet that lets the smiths walk through walls to get to their treasure. ;)
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Recently being a victim of the, in my mind extremely poorly designed, main-quest encounter with Sparrow, I was just thinking the same thing. Pickpocketing is sortof a staple in games like this and it's almost weird to see a game without it.
I disagree with the "have to be unaware" part, however. Using Sparrow with an example, it is impossible to not have her go hostile, if you follow the main quest. At that moment, I would've liked the chance to "combat pickpocket" her and bolt out of there, to keep the storyline consistent.
It confuddles and bedazzles me that such an encounter was even designed so poorly. Following the main quest shouldn't result in lost challenges. I know that there are effective workarounds to the entire situation, but as far as the main quest goes, that's not the way to do it. The quest is in fact very clear in explaining that I should go to Sparrow and get the key from her. Just changing the mainquest into "Aquire a key for the Mines; Sparrow may have one or you may find one elsewhere" could keep the integrity of the main questline. Or just have her refuse to give the key away, making attacking her or not a concious choice.
But nooooooo.
/rant off/
I disagree with the "have to be unaware" part, however. Using Sparrow with an example, it is impossible to not have her go hostile, if you follow the main quest. At that moment, I would've liked the chance to "combat pickpocket" her and bolt out of there, to keep the storyline consistent.
It confuddles and bedazzles me that such an encounter was even designed so poorly. Following the main quest shouldn't result in lost challenges. I know that there are effective workarounds to the entire situation, but as far as the main quest goes, that's not the way to do it. The quest is in fact very clear in explaining that I should go to Sparrow and get the key from her. Just changing the mainquest into "Aquire a key for the Mines; Sparrow may have one or you may find one elsewhere" could keep the integrity of the main questline. Or just have her refuse to give the key away, making attacking her or not a concious choice.
But nooooooo.
/rant off/
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Yes, but I was wondering: if you don't do the Sparrow quest, can you continue with the main quest and go to Picaroon's Island?obiwan wrote:Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
There is?! What is it?!!obiwan wrote:Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Well, it wouldn't surprise me if the guy who OWNS the mine might have a key.IJBall wrote:There is?! What is it?!!obiwan wrote:Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
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Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Hmmm... kill that "miserable sow" who attacks you for no reason, or murder a bunch of innocent dwarfs who are just minding their own business?... I let you take a guess which of those two options I'm usually going to go with...Kreador Freeaxe wrote:Well, it wouldn't surprise me if the guy who OWNS the mine might have a key.IJBall wrote:There is?! What is it?!!obiwan wrote:Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
There's no need to kill any dwarves to get to that key...IJBall wrote:Hmmm... kill that "miserable sow" who attacks you for no reason, or murder a bunch of innocent dwarfs who are just minding their own business?... I let you take a guess which of those two options I'm usually going to go with...
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Exactly. Just because he has a key does not mean that he keeps it on his person at all times.xolotl wrote:There's no need to kill any dwarves to get to that key...IJBall wrote:Hmmm... kill that "miserable sow" who attacks you for no reason, or murder a bunch of innocent dwarfs who are just minding their own business?... I let you take a guess which of those two options I'm usually going to go with...
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Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Picking the lock doesn't turn those guys hostile?! Even though you're always in at least one guard's line-of-sight?! I'm all verklempt!!!Kreador Freeaxe wrote:Exactly. Just because he has a key does not mean that he keeps it on his person at all times.xolotl wrote:There's no need to kill any dwarves to get to that key...
(Yeah, I've never even tried getting through that door, for the very reason that I thought there was no way to pick that lock without the dwarfs "seeing a crime being committed"...)
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Nobody can see you commit a crime if they can't see you.IJBall wrote:Picking the lock doesn't turn those guys hostile?! Even though you're always in at least one guard's line-of-sight?! I'm all verklempt!!!Kreador Freeaxe wrote:Exactly. Just because he has a key does not mean that he keeps it on his person at all times.xolotl wrote:There's no need to kill any dwarves to get to that key...
(Yeah, I've never even tried getting through that door, for the very reason that I thought there was no way to pick that lock without the dwarfs "seeing a crime being committed"...)
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Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Kill 'em all, let the sysadmin sort 'em out.
Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
And there's always ways of inducing forgetfulness on NPCs who have turned against you. :)Kreador Freeaxe wrote:Nobody can see you commit a crime if they can't see you.
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Re: Suggestion for B3: Pickpocketing [B2 Spoilers]
Yes. You just have to get a key. Any key. From anywhere.Elwro wrote:Yes, but I was wondering: if you don't do the Sparrow quest, can you continue with the main quest and go to Picaroon's Island?obiwan wrote:Nobody noticed that there *is* in fact an alternative way to get a key for the mine?
The dwarf lord keeps a key in his bedroom.
My main gripe here isn't the kill-or-not-to-kill Sparrow and how killing someone who deliberately attacks you breaks the Healer Challenge, or how killing leagues of innocent dwarven miners doesn't. It is how the main quest doesn't even really offer an option or even an optional interpretation of the quest - and how following that quest will by default result in a lost challenge.