Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

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CrazyBernie
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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 24th, 2017, 6:46 pm

Are you running the latest Win10 build? I get the same results with the downloaded (full version/demo from the site) version vs the Steam install.

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by SpottedShroom » October 25th, 2017, 5:41 pm

Good point, I was on an old version since I rarely run my Windows 10 VM. After much updating, I'm on version 1709 build 16299.19, and I'm still seeing the same (normal) behavior: I can install the game, make a new character, save, load, exit, load, etc. Maybe the issue is that I'm on Windows 10 Enterprise?

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 26th, 2017, 8:31 pm

Well the only way I can get it to work is if I install on the D: drive and point my saves folder to the D: drive. The only thing I can think of is it might have something to do with my C: drives on both computers being PCI-E M.2 drives... so maybe it's a drive(r) issue.

I've got a new Alienware 15 R3 coming in tomorrow - I'll try it on that (it also has a PCI-E main drive)... it's possible the Blitzmax engine isn't friendly with this type of storage medium (?).

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by BasiliskWrangler » October 26th, 2017, 9:09 pm

CrazyBernie wrote:
October 26th, 2017, 8:31 pm
... it's possible the Blitzmax engine isn't friendly with this type of storage medium (?).
Maybe. But, BlitzMax just rides on top of your OS and communicates via standard system protocols. The underlying code communicates with the filesystem just like any other piece of software, through the OS.
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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 28th, 2017, 11:31 am

Ok, well maybe the file system is too fast... Sorta like the ol' DOS/Windows games that need to be CPU limited to play with emulation. These drives are about 5-10x fast than regular SSDs, which are already pretty quick. It might be reading/writing data quicker than the engine can process and getting hung up as a result. Just a thought.

FedEx failed to deliver the laptop... I left a note online for them to leave it at my apartment's office and they went ahead and tried to bring it to my door anyway (Dell requires a signature to leave a package and I'm not about to authorize them to just dump it on my doorstep). It's says they'll try again today... We'll see.

**UPDATE**
Book3Alienware.jpg
First Game On Alienware!
Book3Alienware.jpg (110.93 KiB) Viewed 1769 times
After installing Book 3 on this beast, I was able to successfully save/load the game with a "Default" Install (I put my Steam in the C:\Games folder, as always). This is with Windows 10 Home build 15063. I'm currently updating to the latest version, so we'll see how it goes!

Laptop Notes:

- I'm digging the Tobi Eye Tracking feature - the laptop dims the screen and kills the lights when you're not paying attention, but as soon as you look at the laptop screen it wakes everything up.

- The Windows Hello login feature is cool, but the camera seems to be having issues.. on a reboot I can log in the first time, but then it's unresponsive if I lock the machine and try to use it again - I have to use the PIN feature instead.

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 28th, 2017, 6:29 pm

Well that clinches it for me.... updated to build 16299.19 and now I can't even launch the game (Same as OP). It's gotta be some sort of driver problem.

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by BasiliskWrangler » October 28th, 2017, 7:07 pm

Hmm, I'm out of ideas.

The only thing I can do now is offer a bounty: I'll give a free Steam code to our next game ("TRP") to whomever finds a workaround / fix that gets Eschalon (1,2, & 3) to run on the latest version of Windows. The workaround needs to work for everyone, not just your computer.
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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 29th, 2017, 1:11 pm

Now now, let's not get too hasty and start giving things away.... that's my job. It's been awhile, but I've been itching to hand out some Steam Keys again.

I've fixed both the Alienware and my Desktop... the fix for two was the same.... but different. I believe there were two separate issues as well... the fact that this fixed the crash on startup I don't find terribly surprising, but the that it fixed the reload issue is something I find perplexing, which is why I didn't try it right away (although there was a couple caveats to that as well). I need to verify whether it works on the final machine before I post it... stay tuned (should be pretty quick)!

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by BasiliskWrangler » October 29th, 2017, 1:32 pm

CB - if you get a fix that works, make a new topic (separate from this one) that identifies the problem and gives a clear solution, and I will sticky it.
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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 30th, 2017, 1:04 pm

Well 2 out of 3 ain't bad, right?

Both my Desktop and the Alienware were fixed with driver updates - Nvidia's 388 drivers on The AW, and the "Optional" Radeon 17.10.3 drives on my desktop. Again, with the crashing on the AW, I'm not particularly surprised that it was driver related. Fixing the load bug was weird, but I guess I could see that... loading assets to dispay on the screen might cause a puking.

Unfortunately the same fix with the Nvidia 388's did not fix my HP Omen laptop. Again, two separate issues... so I guess I'm not surprised that the same driver didn't fix a differnt problem.

That said, Malpercian- what sort of GFx hardware are you running, and what version are your drivers? Windows 10 won't necessarily update the vid drivers on its own, and it seems like every other Win 10 update breaks something that gets fixed on the next go-round. Oh, and sorry for thread-jacking you, since I seem to have had a different problem for the most part, even though I did experience the same on my new laptop.

BW, I'll work out some sort of Windows 10 troubleshooting guide... although it's mostly going to be "update yer stuff, or wait for the next build" combined with already existing fixes/workarounds. I'm probably going to wipe the Omen (I have to send it out for a screen replacement, and then I'll be selling it on eBay - between this and my old gaming laptop I just sold, the Alienware will end up costing me about $100 :mrgreen: ), so I'll see if it happens on a fresh install.

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by blatherbeard » October 30th, 2017, 6:26 pm

My other dev friend had a win 10 update break his upcoming game so hard i think he had to rewrite his code to get it to work. (was something to do with the fact that microsoft is trying to come up with their own version of direct X or something similar and they broke something there. ill have to look back on our website or ask him what the actual issue was.) i know he said it affected all of his indie dev friends)

prob not related but thought id just throw that out there.
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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by blatherbeard » October 30th, 2017, 6:29 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... zAfjT3m-sM

video on what he did, and he breaks it down at the end of the video if you want to skip towards the end.
The armies joined in a bloody battle on this fine day, then storm clouds broke, and it rained.

So they all went home.---Story knots within blatherbeards Beard.

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 30th, 2017, 8:51 pm

Well now, it looks like a Windows reset did the trick! I did a full wipe and reset, but I'm pretty sure a non-destructive reset would do the trick as well... it further cements my conviction that this is a driver, or at least a configuration issue. I'm sure the reset cleaned out a lot of garbage as there's been several build updates in the last year and a half. The best part was it kept all of the driver updates intact. Woohoo! :mrgreen:

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by SpottedShroom » October 31st, 2017, 2:58 pm

Still unable to reproduce on Windows 10 Home 1709 build 16299.19 in a VM

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Re: Game crashes on startup (Windows 10)

Post by CrazyBernie » October 31st, 2017, 9:37 pm

Well considering a VM has a helluva lot fewer drivers to deal with, I can't say I'm really surprised. The only thing I could think of to try reproducing the effect is install an older build and then update it and see what happens. It's probably a low-frequency-occurrence-type situation.

I ended up resetting my desktop as well- my printers decided to start disappearing and I had some files reported corrupt. Now I get to reinstall all my games... yay!

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