Piracy prevention (or at least assessment)

AstralWanderer · Post by **AstralWanderer** » December 7th, 2007, 7:58 pm

Effidian wrote:It isn't disabling the check that is supporting piracy, it is downloading the crack in the first place.

This looks to be another issue of semantics - to me "support" means to provide material assistance, in terms of cash or kind. Downloading content, if anything, does the opposite since it increases a site's bandwidth usage.

Effidian wrote:I very much doubt that the authors of cracks are doing it for paying customers of the game. Do you need to provide proof of purchase to download the crack? Obviously not. You seriously believe that people that write cracks are doing it with the intention it should only be used on games you pay for?

And how, practically, is a crack author supposed to verify authenticity beyond making their crack reliant on having the game installed? You are asking them to do what software publishers themselves cannot (you don't have to "prove" purchase prior to downloading an official patch) which seems quite unrealistic.

Virtually every crack readme file asks people to purchase games that they like and every responsible site makes the point that cracks are for purchased software only (more proof of "good intentions" than anyone can supply of the opposite). Beyond that, it has to be left to individuals' consciences, so it is as reasonable to blame crack authors for subsequent abuse as it is to blame software authors for any abuse of their products (e.g. using a security scanner to break into a system).

Aganazer wrote:It is money. Every game I ever bought in Thailand had the crack burned onto the CD with the game. Those CD's would never pass the copy protection so you need the crack. There is money in cracks.

As Rollor has noted, the crack authors aren't receiving any more money from your "vendor" than the original software authors, so they are as much victims of commercial piracy here. In addition, no-CD cracks are not needed for pirated copies (assuming the copy was accurate enough to pass any CD check).

alpha · Post by **alpha** » December 7th, 2007, 8:13 pm

This grows old.

Any kind piracy protection sucks.
Any DRM system if defective by design.
Even StarForce was f()cked, so please, stop.

Can't you people just realize, that any protection you could come up woth will be eventually broken, but in the meantime, it's presence will decrease user experiance gradually.

Can't beat reverse engeneering - live with that.

BW did a very, very wise decision putting no bullshit into the game, and he has earned an unfathomable respect for that.

YouTube · Post by **BasiliskWrangler** » December 7th, 2007, 9:04 pm

Respect is great, but it doesn't pay any bills.

realmzmaster · Post by **realmzmaster** » December 8th, 2007, 1:20 am

Let me put it this way. If the sales of the game do not cover the costs and make Basilisk games a profit where is the incentive for Basilisk games to keep producing games? You have to remember that Basilisk games and other companies employ people. Look at the credits for Eschalon. Games are no longer created by one person. Game production requires artists, musicians, programmers and others. People want to see some reward (usually monetary) for their hard work. Respect is great, but you cannot eat it. As far as piracy on the world stage more and more countries that want to start their own home grown software industry are looking for ways to combat it. If you think piracy hurts the large software industry in the United States, it would be and has been the death knell for fledgling software industry in other countries.

alpha · Post by **alpha** » December 8th, 2007, 7:11 am

BasiliskWrangler wrote:Respect is great, but it doesn't pay any bills.

Makes me feel awful......... point taken...

realmzmaster · Post by **realmzmaster** » December 8th, 2007, 2:25 pm

Unforunately, dishonesty does not just exist in the software industry. I was just reading about a Shell station in Minocqua, Wisconsin. The attendant was leaving at 10 pm and had to change the price of the gasoline. The attendant was tried. He inadvently typed in .329 instead of 3.299 for the pumps. Now the new price was clearly posted on the main store sign ($3.299). It was the twenty-fifth price change in six months. The attendant left for the night. The service station has self service pumps which accept credit cards. A driver filling up with gas notice the mistake. He filled up and told his friends who told their friends. Before you knew the cars were lined up at the station. This situation attracted the attention of the police, who notified the owner of the station. She came and press the emergency stop, but not before more 589 gallons of gas had been pumped. The gas should have sold for $1943.11, but with the mistake it sold for $193.78. A loss of $1750 in less than two hours. Now suposedly these people were her loyal customers who had bought gas from this station for years. It just goes to show if opportunity presents itself people will take advantage no matter who it hurts. The same occurs when you pirate software, someone is going to get hurt.

PhilosophiX · Post by **PhilosophiX** » December 9th, 2007, 1:47 am

The pirates just take out the DRM. It's only the genuine customers who suffer with DRM. I'm amazed that there are actually users fighting to have DRM put in their games. Don't complain then when all the DRM in windows vista bites you in the a**. Carry on.

macdude22 · Post by **macdude22** » December 9th, 2007, 2:18 am

Vista is the bane of my existence at work. Printers stop working, random resets of WGA, other applications that aren't compatible. I'll take nice stable XP all the way (well I use a mac, but as far as Windows goes nice stable XP all the way).

alpha · Post by **alpha** » December 9th, 2007, 12:40 pm

may be a bit off-topic but still worth mentioning: www.badvista.org

quasius · Post by **quasius** » December 10th, 2007, 12:37 pm

alpha wrote:may be a bit off-topic but still worth mentioning: www.badvista.org

That link made no sense and looks like it a collaboration of Steve Jobs, linux elitists, and people who think coders should work for free.

This link is on-topic and much better:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Xfqkdh5Js4

alpha · Post by **alpha** » December 10th, 2007, 12:47 pm

quasius wrote:linux elitists

Exactly.

thomas · Post by **thomas** » December 27th, 2007, 11:57 am

BasiliskWrangler wrote:Pirating drives up the price of games, movies and CDs

I don't agree with this part - it might be true for small teams with some sense of morale, but it is definitely not truth when it comes to companies with it's own business departement.

Those will make such great prize as possible, to be buyable for enought people - think of it as calculus, placing derivation of sold-ammount * prize equal to zero, and having more people buying the product will only mean more porsche cars for management, not lowering prize of further products.

realmzmaster · Post by **realmzmaster** » December 27th, 2007, 12:59 pm

But there lies the point! If more people pirate the product that equates into less sales. If publisher cannot cover their costs at a lower price point they will raise the price to a point where they can cover their costs based on past piracy of a similar product. Example Madden NFL 2007 is published at $49.95 and 50% of the potential buyers pirate the product that means I must cover my costs and derive a profit from the 50% who actually buy the product. So for Madden NFL 2008 I will raise the price to $59.95 to cover the cost of piracy, production/development costs and a make a profit. For a large outfit that may be possible, but for smaller outfits probably not.

Let us also dispell this notion of every one in the software industry running around driving porsches. This situation may be true of some members of upper management, but for vast number of people that are employed by these companies you have got to be joking. Let us also remember that Bioware , Blizzard and EA did not start as large companies. They grew because of successful products. (Yes people actually bought the software.) Many smaller companies have died because people pirated their software and the company was unable to cover their costs. If you are not buying the product that is money the company is missing out on. Do not try to justify piracy. Do not think that everyone in the software industry is Steve Job's or Bill Gates rich. Most of them are just like you and me trying to eke out a living ,keep their families fed and have a roof over their heads.

YouTube · December 27th, 2007, 1:03 pm

realmzmaster wrote:Let us also dispell this notion of every one in the software industry running around driving porsches. This situation may be true of some members of upper management, but for vast number of people that are employed by these companies you have got to be joking. Let us also remember that Bioware , Blizzard and EA did not start as large companies. They grew because of successful products. (Yes people actually bought the software.) Many smaller companies have died because people pirated their software and the company was unable to cover their costs. If you are not buying the product that is money the company is missing out on. Do not try to justify piracy. Do not think that everyone in the software industry is Steve Job's or Bill Gates rich. Most of them are just like you and me trying to eke out a living ,keep their families fed and have a roof over their heads.

Excellent post realmzmaster. I was trying to come up with the same response but found myself using too many four-letter words. Thank you.

realmzmaster · Post by **realmzmaster** » December 27th, 2007, 2:00 pm

You are welcome! I am just trying to disspell some of the misconceptions that people have about the software industry, especially small independent firms that are trying to make quality products that fill a niche market that is being overlooked. Most people fail to understand that games have a limited sales life. Most of the money will be made in the time from the initial release to about two or three months after the release. Also you are competing with all the other games for the buying public's attention and money. Small companies need all the sales they can get to survive and grow..