The Drunken Lizard Pub

I finished the game and I wanted to suggest for book 2 a substantial change in the random rolls system. Why not make it predetermined ? When you enter a zone a certain amount of random rolls are predetermined, for example a 1000 rolls and everything you do follows those rolls, you can reload 20 times but if you do exactly the same actions you will have the same result.

That is more or less the system jagged alliance 2 uses (what a game), if you save just before a death blow you can reload but that roll is predetermined and your character is gonna die, unless you do something different instead of taking the blow like moving and taking cover.

That would make pick locks, removing traps, moving silently and all these skills finally useful, instead of taking 1 point in them and just reload until you get the good roll, not mentioning difficult fights, where you can just reload until he misses and you hit.

Thanks

Actually we have beaten this topic to death. See viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1154

No what I say is totally different, not only treasure is rolled randomly everytime but also rolls to pick locks and disarm traps and attack enemies and so on are all rolled the exact time you perform the action, THAT is what has to change to completely better the usefulness of skill and inhibit reloads in general.

Not just treasure.

The concept is still the same! Why would I want to limit rerolls or reloads. The bottom line is whether or not you choose to abuse the system. If you do so be it. What you want the designer to do is take away the temptation to do something everyone can do for themselves. What you want is to limit the luck factor. Why? What purpose would it serve?

Because in massively popular games like jagged alliance it worked great and in eschalon book 1 it didn't work that great...after a little the reload thing was automatically excluding the fear of getting caught by a trap or not being able to open a door, you could always reload instead of taking the blow by trap x and camping for the 1000th time in the same hour to regain life points.

Rpgs are about story and action, if the story is modest and the action is repetitive and the chance of doing something irreparable is very very low...where is the challenge in that ?

Don't take me wrong, I love eschalon and bought it the second after I finished the demo, but it has it's flaws and I'm just pointing to what I think is a good direction.

Maybe I am missing something? Because Jagged Alliance did it that makes it good for another game. If you want massively popular you can pick everything from Baldur's Gate to Planescape Torment to Temple of Elemental Evil that does not do it that way. If I want to sit there and re-roll until hell freezes over how does that affect how you play the game. Some people are perfectly happy rolling to get the uber character or re-rolling for treasure or events. Why should their enjoyment be diminished? It does not affect how I play the game.

Would you like to play if you die you roll a new character and start playing from scratch? Or you are allowed no healing potions. All healing must be done by a cleric at a holy site.

CRPG's in the past only allowed saving at an inn. Which is kind of difficult when you are 6 levels down in a dungeon. Now that caused real tension especially if half your party is dead and you have to fight your way back to the inn. No one is saying you have to re-roll. You play the game your way and let others play it their way.

Your point is valid but Baldur's Gate was not a turn based game, what is the meaning of saving the game right before the bad guy attacks you when other 10 enemies are threatening your other 5 characters? the games was fast and there was no time for precise rerolling or excessive reloads, you just saved before a big fight and if it didn't go well you reloaded and started the battle again from the beginning. It was a long game full of real challenges, you didn't know for example the percentile of picking a lock or disarming a trap, you either pumped your thief or not.

Toee was bad, and that's it, a boring and bad game, I just played the demo.

Maybe preventing savegames during a fight and not knowing the chance of picking and disarming is a good solution without ruining your "fun". Let me know.

Actually it is not my fun. When I roll a character I take the first attempt and keep going. I do not save before each chest. I take whatever is in the chest on the first attempt and keep going. I rarely save before a big battle. (usually only when the wife needs the computer). It does not matter if I know the percentage chance of picking a lock. If I have a 25% chance (1 in 4), it still does not mean I will pick the lock. The probability I will pick the lock is better, but each attempt still has the same odds. I still have a 75% chance of failure. In the long run I should be able to pick the lock, but Las Vegas is full of broke gamblers who thought that way.

But, other people do like to reroll their characters, and reroll for loot. As you read the forum you will see quite a few people like to play that way.

As for TOEE, I played the full game and had a great deal of fun. Tacticals cRPG's may not be your cup of tea. I had a blast and so did others on the forum. Look under the Drunken Lizard Pub. Role playing games.