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Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 13th, 2010, 8:42 pm
by Slarty
First of, a list of skills and trainers. All skills but three have books available: once per skill, you can read the book either to get a free first point (worth 3 sp) or two free points after that (worth 2 sp). Half the skills have a trainer, who you can pay to raise your skill as high as 8 for free... but no higher. The upshot is that if you REALLY want to min-max skills, you want to avoid raising them until after utilizing trainers & books.

Training cost is 100 gp, then 200, 300, etc... total of 3600 gold for level 8.
Asterisked items are available as the "free" skill for a class/alignment combo.

TRAINER (to level 8) AND BOOK (to level 10):
Alchemy
Arcane, Divination*
Arcane, Elemental*
Cartography
Forage
Hide in Shadows
Move Silently
Pick Locks*
Weapons, Bludgeoning*
Weapons, Bows*
Weapons, Cleaving*
Weapons, Swords*

TRAINER (to level 8) ONLY:
Repair
Weapons, Thrown

BOOK (to level 1) ONLY:
Armor, Light
Armor, Heavy
Armor, Shields*
Dodge
Lore*
Medicine*
Mercantile
Skullduggery
Spot Hidden
Unarmed Combat
Weapons, Piercing*

NO TRAINERS OR BOOKS:
Meditation

Meditation is not available as a class-based skill, so the best you can do to use those free points is Shields, Lore, Medicine, or Piercing Weapons... none of which are particularly necessary or useful skills for the min-maxxer. Piercing Weapons is available for the Nefarious Cleric, however, one of the more attractive options. Nefarious probably is the best alignment given cost-benefit analysis. Druidism is dangerous -- it has the best bonus, but it has the worst drawback, and can be irritating when underground. Atheism is to be avoided because buffs are still overpowered.

The Druid Cleric has Medicine, and the Druid Fighter has Shields.

Stats:
Unless things have changed since book I in non-obvious ways, max Perception or Endurance for the creation MP/HP bonuses, probably Perception. If you aren't waiting for trainers to take spells, get Int or Wis or both up to 15.

Thoughts?

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 12:12 am
by Sajen
This is all stuff that is good to know. I didn't realize you can learn a lot of the skills by books and trainers.

And I guess in the further parts you will give hints on where to find these books and trainers to get the particular skills?

This game needs a good walk through or guide.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 1:18 am
by Michi
Hi,

Since its unlikely that I will play through the whole game more than once, it would be great of you could post a few critical things:

1. Location of trainers, and a very simple idea of how to get to them from the starting town ... if its anything like Book 1, its possible to get there at a low level if you are very careful and patient.

2. The points/level of HP & Mana based on Perception, Endurance and Int/Wis for Mage/Healer

Thanks!
michi

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 3:20 pm
by Slarty
I haven't played through the game so can't help much with specific trainer locations. The best ones (elemental, alchemy, swords, etc) are mostly in Port Kuudad.

I'm not sure anyone has a precise answer to your second question. There is a thread in the Book I forum giving that information for Book I. I don't know if it's 100% accurate for Book II. In Book I, fighters/rogues/rangers got +2 HP per level while magic-users/healers got +2 MP per level. Additional bonus scores came every 5 points of END/PER and every 10 points of STR/INT/WIS (WIS for healers, INT for the others). That was also the only thing class affected in any way shape or form. Also, on character creation ONLY, you got +1 HP per point of END and +1 MP per point of PER, and half that for the secondary stats (STR/INT/WIS).

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 3:43 pm
by golgepapaz
anybody know where is the foraging trainer?
and i am getting 5hp with 24 con and 8mana with 39 perception,so the above formula may not hold. There can be diminishing retuns though

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 3:48 pm
by Randomizer
Mana caps at 9 per level when you level up at 40 perception.
I've seen 10 hit points per level with over 40 endurance.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 5:05 pm
by Slarty
I might be misremembering -- maybe it was +1 every 10 points of END/PER and the others were only relevant at creation? I forget.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 14th, 2010, 6:55 pm
by Dragonlady
golgepapaz wrote:anybody know where is the foraging trainer?
:) I ansered this in a round about fashion in another subject area.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 15th, 2010, 6:12 pm
by Michi
Wondering where the more thief-like arts are taught, since I didn't take lock-picking and would rather not burn the skill points.

So, far I have found the following trainers in Port K. if anyone is interested:

Swords, Crush and Cleave
Divinity and Elemental
Cartography
Alchemy

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 15th, 2010, 7:15 pm
by Dragonlady
Michi wrote:Wondering where the more thief-like arts are taught, since I didn't take lock-picking and would rather not burn the skill points.

So, far I have found the following trainers in Port K. if anyone is interested:

Swords, Crush and Cleave
Divinity and Elemental
Cartography
Alchemy
Well, if your looking for skills a thief would like, then think where a thief would hide best in a town/city? Try somewhere in the sewers... :)

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 16th, 2010, 2:30 pm
by Eschalonian
Does anyone know where the Bows trainer is?

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 16th, 2010, 2:34 pm
by Randomizer
Eschalonian wrote:Does anyone know where the Bows trainer is?
Bows, thrown weapons and foraging are from Hunter at Fletcher's Grove off the beaten path in Wolfenwood.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 16th, 2010, 5:21 pm
by Eschalonian
Wow. Someone actually gave a straight answer, not a DragonLady-like cryptic remark. Thank you so much.

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 16th, 2010, 5:42 pm
by Randomizer
Eschalonian wrote:Wow. Someone actually gave a straight answer, not a DragonLady-like cryptic remark. Thank you so much.
Now try finding her. *snicker*

Re: Min-Maxxing Part I: Trainers / Rolling PCs

Posted: May 16th, 2010, 7:29 pm
by Eschalonian
There's no Fletcher's Grove in Wolfenwood, is there?