The Drunken Lizard Pub

Is there a difference between light and heavy armor besides, damage resistance, the ability to move silently and weight?

bryan wrote:Is there a difference between light and heavy armor besides, damage resistance, the ability to move silently and weight?

Actually there are not too many differences between light and heavy armor in terms of protection. There are many pieces of light armor that are as good, if not better, than much heavy armor. And, of course, light armor weighs a whole lot less. What you really want to do is to put 1 point into each category. That gives you maximum flexibility.

Very few people find it worthwhile to invest any more points than that in armor. You should be pumping your major skills, and armor is not one of those.

Thanks for the info!

Painted Lady wrote:Very few people find it worthwhile to invest any more points than that in armor. You should be pumping your major skills, and armor is not one of those.

The way it should work is- the more skilled you are in Armor, the greater amount of "Damage Reduction" you receive. Damage Reduction is (as it sounds) a direct reduction of damage from an attack. However, this "feature" was never fully worked out and it takes a lot of points in your Armor Skills to actually see any notable reduction. If I have the time, I'll likely remove Damage Reduction from the game altogether, but it's low on my list since it's a non-intrusive feature.

However, being more skilled in your preferred form of armor slows down the rate at which it wears out. Being very well skilled can greatly improve the life of your armor.

Also, new in Book III: armor pieces will have a minimum armor skill requirement to use. If you have less than, you can still wear the armor, but you receive adjusted penalties. Before you old-timers moan and groan, I will say that the Minimal Skill required is very manageable (easy to comply with), and also Book III has Armor Trainers to help you out. This is a far more realistic approach to armor usage than allowing you to wear full Mithril Plate with a measly Heavy Armor skill of 1.

BasiliskWrangler wrote:Also, new in Book III: armor pieces will have a minimum armor skill requirement to use. If you have less than, you can still wear the armor, but you receive adjusted penalties. Before you old-timers moan and groan, I will say that the Minimal Skill required is very manageable (easy to comply with), and also Book III has Armor Trainers to help you out. This is a far more realistic approach to armor usage than allowing you to wear full Mithril Plate with a measly Heavy Armor skill of 1.

That's probably fair.

Of course, it also probably means that I'll never bother with Heavy Armor again...

BasiliskWrangler wrote:Also, new in Book III: armor pieces will have a minimum armor skill requirement to use. If you have less than, you can still wear the armor, but you receive adjusted penalties. Before you old-timers moan and groan, I will say that the Minimal Skill required is very manageable (easy to comply with), and also Book III has Armor Trainers to help you out. This is a far more realistic approach to armor usage than allowing you to wear full Mithril Plate with a measly Heavy Armor skill of 1.

Wow - how fun. That is going to make the various challenge replays much more interesting. What a great idea.

IJBall wrote:Of course, it also probably means that I'll never bother with Heavy Armor again...

Pound for pound, heavy armor is superior to light armor (in Book III). If you are going to invest points in an armor skill, Heavy Armor is the most ideal except that it tends to be scarce at early levels.

Light Armor is really better suited for characters who need to put more points in Intellect attributes, thus leaving their strength insufficient for heavier armors.

That sounds like a great fix to the armor skill "problem" from the first two games. Looking forward to it!

It comes to me that making a skill distinction between "light" and "heavy" armor isn't very sensible.

What makes a little more sense is to distinguish armor by its main type, chain or plate. Once you have experience in a particular armor, it should give a minimum understanding of all armor.

Whether it's "light" or "heavy" will depend on your strength.

Wearing too much armor for your strength should have some penalties to movement, action and exhaustion.

In as far as training, doing something long enough should result in a skill in usage. Human beings are like that.

Emelio Lizardo wrote:In as far as training, doing something long enough should result in a skill in usage. Human beings are like that.

After 45 years of experience with my fellow humans, I feel safe in saying "Not always."

Game developers are too in love with the old D&D system.

Each skill should be, separately, advanced upon usage, training or study. Back in the paper and pencil days it would be a nightmare attempting to track that but with modern programmable computing machines it should be a breeze.

Every time you swing your sword you should advance your ability in sword and to some lesser extent general combat.

In that same vein, all the skills you fail to use should be subject to some amount of decay. If you don't regularly forage for your porridge you begin to lose your edge.

And unless you are a polymath or have some innate flexibility of mind, the more you specialize in one area the less your mind is able to grasp concepts outside (particularly knowledge diametrically apposed to) that field.

This is a dynamic system that gives the player a more flexible means to advancement that compliments his activities in a way more natural to his way of play.

There's a problem with that system. If you need a skill late game but not early game, you'd have to go on a grindfest to catch up with it. Besides, it removes the possibility for tweaking characters, since skill levels are directly dependant on how much you put yourself at risk. Thirdly, if you're a fighter who happens to get lucky with, for example, not getting hit much early game, your defensive stats will be below the level you need them to be at later.

The D&D system is a substitute for this that swaps the cause and effect. You want to give your character certain abilities of a certain level for future endeavours, so you invest skillpoints in them.

Natural i'll give you, but flexible? no. The point is moot, really. The game's already far too much into developement to completely change something as major as the skill system, not to mention that it would be weird to do so for only the final installment of the series. It's not what the long term players are after.

If you like the "practice skills to get good at them" paradigm, there are plenty of games that do that. It may be more realistic, but personally I prefer the point system.

I note that the weigh of armor (and weapons) steadily increases with their effectiveness. In fact better materials can be much lighter, as well as better construction can make stronger armor with less of the same material. Particularly Mithril has always been described a being very light.

It's tempting to just make everything progressive in a game but it needn't be that way.

Yeah, i'm quite in favor of steadily improving equipment through their average quality, based on all the properties of a single item rather than improving all properties in a linear fashion. It gives more variety. Still, i dunno what they've done for the third game. Only know that it's different.