Some Technical/Engine Questions for BW

[IJBall]

Hey, BW! Hope all is going well with Book II work!

Anyway, in thinking about what kinds of scenarios those of us on the fan end-of-things may be able to come up with down the road, it got me to thinking and I came up with a few questions about the Book I (or Book II) engine(s) that I was hoping you could answer.

What I was wondering was:

1. Is possible for there to be random placement of items (or monsters) within a single map in either Book I or Book II?
   (In looking at xolotl's developing Map Editor, it really does look like items (& monsters) have to be "placed" at a grid location when developing a map - I'm wondering if that's the case, or if items & monsters can be randomly placed within a map...)
2. Is possible for there to be random placement of items among multiple maps in either Book I or Book II?
   (I imagine this is a far trickier prospect, and I'm not really expecting this to be possible...)
3. Is possible to set certain items either to attract, or to repel, certain monsters (or NPCs)?
   (It would be neat if, say, a certain 'cursed' items would attract, say, Tauraxes to you, whether you were in their line-of-sight, or not. Or conversely, it might be cool to have a magical item that, when wielded/used, could repel all goblins, for example.)
4. Is it possible to create monsters or NPCs that can take (steal) objects from your character in either Book I or Book II?
   (One of the challenges that I loved/hated(!) about some of the Ultimas were the gremlins that would steal food from you, or the theives/cutpurses that would steal weapons & armor. Having something similar in the Eschalon world might be neat! This one seems like it should be possible because the Acid Grubbs in Book I can actually destroy player's items when they 'blow up' upon death...)

Anyway, hope all is going well and that you're not too busy!

[Kreador Freeaxe]

Is possible to set certain items either to attract, or to repel, certain monsters (or NPCs)?
(It would be neat if, say, a certain 'cursed' items would attract, say, Tauraxes to you, whether you were in their line-of-sight, or not. Or conversely, it might be cool to have a magical item that, when wielded/used, could repel all goblins, for example.)

Hmmm. Then you could make a "Cloak of Getthefuckawayfromme".

[BasiliskWrangler]

1. Is possible for there to be random placement of items (or monsters) within a single map in either Book I or Book II?
   (In looking at xolotl's developing Map Editor, it really does look like items (& monsters) have to be "placed" at a grid location when developing a map - I'm wondering if that's the case, or if items & monsters can be randomly placed within a map...)
2. Is possible for there to be random placement of items among multiple maps in either Book I or Book II?
   (I imagine this is a far trickier prospect, and I'm not really expecting this to be possible...)
3. Is possible to set certain items either to attract, or to repel, certain monsters (or NPCs)?
   (It would be neat if, say, a certain 'cursed' items would attract, say, Tauraxes to you, whether you were in their line-of-sight, or not. Or conversely, it might be cool to have a magical item that, when wielded/used, could repel all goblins, for example.)
4. Is it possible to create monsters or NPCs that can take (steal) objects from your character in either Book I or Book II?
   (One of the challenges that I loved/hated(!) about some of the Ultimas were the gremlins that would steal food from you, or the theives/cutpurses that would steal weapons & armor. Having something similar in the Eschalon world might be neat! This one seems like it should be possible because the Acid Grubbs in Book I can actually destroy player's items when they 'blow up' upon death...)

1) Not in Book 1, or likely Book 2. Everything is hand-placed for that custom feel. When all our tools for Book III are released, I'm sure we'll have random entities as a map option.

2) I am not sure what you are asking.

3) Not with Book 1. Book 2 has an additional flag to allow for "attraction/repulsion of entities to player", which can be activated via a script. It is used in a way similar to what you are describing.

4) No, for Book 1. The Acid Grubs effect is a hard-coded script, ran when you fail a saving throw. Theft of items could be done the same way I suppose, though this would need to go into Book 2's engine. Book 1 isn't flexible enough to handle the addition of a brand-new script without some internal coding to parse it.

Remember, Book 1 has a LOT of hard-coded conditions and events. It means the game engine isn't very flexible for modding, but it was quicker to develop. Games built entirely on scripting engines and open formats are the most flexible, but that can greatly extend development time. Book 2 will be a step closer in that direction, and Book 3 should be fully moddable.

[IJBall]

Remember, Book 1 has a LOT of hard-coded conditions and events. It means the game engine isn't very flexible for modding, but it was quicker to develop. Games built entirely on scripting engines and open formats are the most flexible, but that can greatly extend development time. Book 2 will be a step closer in that direction, and Book 3 should be fully moddable.

Thanks for the quick response, BW.

I figured that most of those things weren't possible with the Book I engine. It's cool that at least attraction/repulsion may be an option for Book II. I also think it would be neat if the monster/NPC 'thieving' thing could be added as an option in Book III.

2. Is possible for there to be random placement of items among multiple maps in either Book I or Book II?
(I imagine this is a far trickier prospect, and I'm not really expecting this to be possible...)

2) I am not sure what you are asking.

OK, anyone else around here remember the Atari 2600 game Adventure? In Level 3 of that game, items in the game started getting placed randomly anywhere in the gameworld.

The equivalent in Eschalon would be let's say if, for example, the Amulet Passkey wasn't just placed randomly somewhere in the Eversleep Cemetery map, but placed somewhere randomly within the entire Thaermore gameworld! (i.e. it could be found anywhere between, say, Blackwater and Vela!) every time a player started a new game.

The idea being, if scenario developers could set an option for having an object placed randomly anywhere in the gameworld, it could potentially increase the replay value of player-created scenarios.

But, like I said - I'm expecting that would be much harder to code for, so I'm not really expecting it to be possible.

[BasiliskWrangler]

The equivalent in Eschalon would be let's say if, for example, the Amulet Passkey wasn't just placed randomly somewhere in the Eversleep Cemetery map, but placed somewhere randomly within the entire Thaermore gameworld! (i.e. it could be found anywhere between, say, Blackwater and Vela!) every time a player started a new game.

That's really a cool idea. Won't happen for Book 2, but lets discuss this for Book 3. I could see a special starting option where certain quest items, or specialty items, get shuffled around the game world before you start. That would certainly expand on some replayability.

[dare49devil]

The equivalent in Eschalon would be let's say if, for example, the Amulet Passkey wasn't just placed randomly somewhere in the Eversleep Cemetery map, but placed somewhere randomly within the entire Thaermore gameworld! (i.e. it could be found anywhere between, say, Blackwater and Vela!) every time a player started a new game.

That's really a cool idea. Won't happen for Book 2, but lets discuss this for Book 3. I could see a special starting option where certain quest items, or specialty items, get shuffled around the game world before you start. That would certainly expand on some replayability.

-Yea-ish. Just don't make it sooo random that you are like wtf where is it!?

[Unclever title]

The equivalent in Eschalon would be let's say if, for example, the Amulet Passkey wasn't just placed randomly somewhere in the Eversleep Cemetery map, but placed somewhere randomly within the entire Thaermore gameworld! (i.e. it could be found anywhere between, say, Blackwater and Vela!) every time a player started a new game.

That's really a cool idea. Won't happen for Book 2, but lets discuss this for Book 3. I could see a special starting option where certain quest items, or specialty items, get shuffled around the game world before you start. That would certainly expand on some replayability.

This also almost seems appropriate for say a particular foe you are quested to hunt down, though that seems as though it might be an even more frustrating if that enemy gets too hard to find.

Anyway I do like the idea and I would like to see it implemented with at least one item in Book 3.

[Kreador Freeaxe]

Hmmmm. The repel feature could also be used to make your adventurer need to take a bath. Some NPCs won't let you close enough to talk if you haven't taken a night at the local inn (and presumably getting cleaned up in the process). That would add an amusing bit to the UI. Some of the NPCs might have to say, "Why don't you go get a bath?" or some such to give the player a hint.

[dare49devil]

Hmmmm. The repel feature could also be used to make your adventurer need to take a bath. Some NPCs won't let you close enough to talk if you haven't taken a night at the local inn (and presumably getting cleaned up in the process). That would add an amusing bit to the UI. Some of the NPCs might have to say, "Why don't you go get a bath?" or some such to give the player a hint.

-Hah, would be amusing, but hey now, let's not make so many little tasks for our character to do just to play the game. =P