Healer Build Q's

[Isshy]

I have a lvl 7 True Druid. Playing him as fighter with support spellcasting. He absolutely crushes every enemy he meets so far but I am concerned for his future.

Stats:
20STR
12DEX
35END
15SPD
13INT
15WIS
22PER
12CON

Skills:
10 Divination
20 Bludgeon
3 Light Armor
1 Heavy Armor
Plus other inconsequential skills I've found/trained like Cart/Dodge/foraging etc.


I am planning on putting the next 3 stat points into PER for the mana bump at 25 and I want 1 more point in Divination to make 11 for the better casting abilities.

Where to go from here? I am in a quandary as to his direction. I would really like a ranged attack and Alchemy looks quite tasty.

1) How many points do I want in Bludgeoning and STR to be effective late game? Will I want more speed or Endurance?

2) Should I further develop Divine magic? Looks like I wont have the attribute points to invest in PER and WIS too deeply as Bludgeoning is his main skill so he needs lots of STR. Both DEX and CON are pleading to be raised to 15 as well. Five more points in wis would be nice however for the tier 2 spells (or maybe I can find some + Wis gear to learn the tier 2 spells).

3) Is throwing weapons a natural choice as STR is a base attribute for them? Would bows be possible with this toon?

4) Shield. Yea or Nay? If yea how many points do you like?

Just not sure which direction to go in and where to put my skill points. If 20 in Bludgeoning is good and 11 in Div is good and I am putting Alchemy off until I can afford to train it....

[ManusDei]

You will need wisdow up to 25 so you can learn high level spells. You can use items for that, that you put on just when you want to learn spells.

If you want to be effective in Bludgeoning, without magic you'd need 35. With magic, less, but I don't know how much (you you can go with 35 to become a weapon of mass destruction ).

[Antigrav]

Looks paladiny. It's a great strategy, having a fighter buffed with holiness. If you choose to go with a shield, cat's eyes makes fighting feasible, but if you're going to be holding that much weight in your hands you'll need oodles of strength, and I haven't found shields worthwhile in Eschalon. Lots of weight for a couple of points of armor and complications in casting. You might find the book or amulet and you can try it out for no skill points.

Thrown weapons are okay if you don't want to crank up your dex, but they get very heavy. For the odd ranged attack, how about sticking with offensive divination spells?

I'd work bludgeoning up toward 30. Some people like to put their main weapon skill closer to 40, but I've never been over 35 and never had a problem. Plus, you've got Bless. Not to mention the Ogre Strength and Nimbleness buffs.

I'd increase dexterity a bit. You're playing a melee fighter after all. If it was my character, I'd get dex up to 20 and then focus on strength and perception, like a 2:3 ratio.

Alchemy pays off if you want to max out your armor. Otherwise, as you're investing in divination, you don't really need to churn out your own potions. What you find/buy is really enough.

[Isshy]

Thanks for the helpful replies! I will put more into Bludgeoning the next few levels to get it to 30. How much STR do you think he'll need? Do you think he will have enough attribute points to raise PER/WIS for the casting or should I just leave it low level and concentrate on the STR/DEX for the melee?

[ManusDei]

I just finished Book 2 with a pure fighter, I think I had around 29 Strength.
But I put a lot of points in Endurance (40) so I could carry the weight (didn't use magic at all).

You get better chances to hit with high skill points, whereas stat points don't help much.

[Isshy]

I just finished Book 2 with a pure fighter, I think I had around 29 Strength.
But I put a lot of points in Endurance (40) so I could carry the weight (didn't use magic at all).

You get better chances to hit with high skill points, whereas stat points don't help much.

I didn't think that endurance affected carrying capacity... now I am confused lol.

[Kreador Freeaxe]

I just finished Book 2 with a pure fighter, I think I had around 29 Strength.
But I put a lot of points in Endurance (40) so I could carry the weight (didn't use magic at all).

You get better chances to hit with high skill points, whereas stat points don't help much.

I didn't think that endurance affected carrying capacity... now I am confused lol.

Endurance doesn't affect carrying capacity. Strength and Concentration do. 5 pounds per point of Strength, 2 pounds per point of Concentration, iirc.

[Isshy]

I just finished Book 2 with a pure fighter, I think I had around 29 Strength.
But I put a lot of points in Endurance (40) so I could carry the weight (didn't use magic at all).

You get better chances to hit with high skill points, whereas stat points don't help much.

I didn't think that endurance affected carrying capacity... now I am confused lol.

Endurance doesn't affect carrying capacity. Strength and Concentration do. 5 pounds per point of Strength, 2 pounds per point of Concentration, iirc.

I thought so... thanks. Maybe ManusDei meant Concentration and not Endurance?

So back to the question. How much STR do you think he'll need? Will there be enough attribute points left over to develop WIS and PER for the Divine magic?

[Kreador Freeaxe]

So back to the question. How much STR do you think he'll need? Will there be enough attribute points left over to develop WIS and PER for the Divine magic?

Well, there's enough equipment to raise your Wisdom by 8 points, so 17 Wisdom allows you to learn every level of Divine spell (with the bonuses), and if you're careful about which spells you learn, should be plenty of available spell slots (remembering you can only learn a number of spells equal to half the relevant stat). In terms of shields, unless you're really going to focus on them, they're not worth the skill points, so Strength + Concentration enough to cast spells in combat should be sufficient, and with Ogre Strength (be careful to try to keep it active), there should be no problem at all so free to focus more on building Perception to increase the mana pool.

[Isshy]

So back to the question. How much STR do you think he'll need? Will there be enough attribute points left over to develop WIS and PER for the Divine magic?

Well, there's enough equipment to raise your Wisdom by 8 points, so 17 Wisdom allows you to learn every level of Divine spell (with the bonuses), and if you're careful about which spells you learn, should be plenty of available spell slots (remembering you can only learn a number of spells equal to half the relevant stat). In terms of shields, unless you're really going to focus on them, they're not worth the skill points, so Strength + Concentration enough to cast spells in combat should be sufficient, and with Ogre Strength (be careful to try to keep it active), there should be no problem at all so free to focus more on building Perception to increase the mana pool.

Cool. Thanks!

[SpottedShroom]

There's no need for anyone to boost strength unless you're planning to use heavy armor. Or maybe if you like carrying around lots of powder kegs :)

By far the most useful stats to boost are Endurance for max HP and HP regen, or Perception for max MP and MP regen. Intelligence and Wisdom are important for learning spells, of course, but you can put on stat-boosting items, read the scroll, then take them off again. Dexterity, Speed, and Concentration are basically never worth boosting.

[Kreador Freeaxe]

There's no need for anyone to boost strength unless you're planning to use heavy armor. Or maybe if you like carrying around lots of powder kegs

By far the most useful stats to boost are Endurance for max HP and HP regen, or Perception for max MP and MP regen. Intelligence and Wisdom are important for learning spells, of course, but you can put on stat-boosting items, read the scroll, then take them off again. Dexterity, Speed, and Concentration are basically never worth boosting.

Depends on your class, Spotted Shroom. In this case as a healer/paladin type, I agree, but for a Ranger, Dex and Con are the two most important stats.

[SpottedShroom]

Depends on your class, Spotted Shroom. In this case as a healer/paladin type, I agree, but for a Ranger, Dex and Con are the two most important stats.

How do you figure? Both are going to give you small skill boosts, but skill points are much easier to come by than stat points. I've never boosted Dexterity or Concentration for my rangers, only Strength, Endurance, or Perception.

[Jumping Jack]

This was the type of character I did my first playthrough with, it's quite fun IMO! Thoughts:

-When calculating stat/skill points available, know that the character will likely end up at around lvl 20 or so if you do quests but aren't camping for eternity for enemies to spawn. Say, 20 lvlups from 1->21, that's 60 skill/statpoints available after char creation.

-You need a bit of STR and Ogre Strength(+24) to keep casting in combat. I ended up with a mihtril war maul weighing 15.0(bought it in dwarftown). So that alone needs 45 strength to keep casting in combat. Though just 1 step below is the warhammer, much lighter at 9.0(mithril). Adamantium or divine ore weapon might be a bit heavier, but they're more rare. Heavy gloves would need more strength. For example, strength 57 in total would let you wield the mithril maul and mithril scale gauntlets(weight 3.8, armor 6). You'll likely end up wearing an amulet with +2 strength and rings can give you +3 each.

-Following that, you can pretty much forget shields, they're way too heavy to cast with. If you really wanted to I suppose you could have a shield as weapon switch #2. Though I used that for a back-up lighter weapon in case I got caught off-guard without my ogre strength up.

- I pumped Perception to 42 for 1 MP/turn regeneration. This let me keep up ogre strength and nimbleness, gravediggers flame and such indefinately. The mana regenerated fast enough that even when I then cast shorter buffs for combat (bless, haste...) the mana had usually regened by the time the next fight came around. Again rings can help with +3 perception each, but I went for hard points in PE.

-With regards to spells, 20 in divination is enough to max the 2nd tier, most importantly Haste and Ogre strength. I didn't find it worthwhile to go for the 3rd tier spells(needs 31 skill). You're supposed to bash the enemies with your hammer anyway and not nuke them to bolivion. Late game I boosted elemental to 20 as well(trainer and book give the first 10). Dense nimbus, chameleon(=invisibility lite), trapkill and lock melt were nice to have, although maybe not necessary.

-32 weapon skill caps the weapon feat recharge at 5 turns. Get at least this much as the bludgeoning feat is great, you will rely on it to hit tough enemies. The Devastating blow automatically hits, and it makes consecutive blows easier to land on your foe(-50% armor). Your skillpoints are probably spread all over the place so you might not have any left to pump it further, though extra weapon skill does give you +1 to hit and +1 damage every 2 points.

-Concerning to-hit, I didn't optimize my char for it(being my first), but looking around the strategy central and a quick calculation gives a ballpark figure to shoot for in your character screen: 29. That should give you 99% to hit regular non-boss enemies after they've been thwacked once with your D.Blow. You shouldn't need to pump conentration or dex to reach it(or come close), even with power attack, spend those stat points on endurance and perception. You've got bless and nimbleness and hopefully a couple of + to-hit from equipment.

-Spells are good enough for ranged attacks, you might not need a bow at all. Not enough skill points to go around...

So to summarize character goals:

Enough strength to cast with in combat (with +24 from ogre strength)
Weapon skill 32
Divination 20
Lots of perception
Endurance won't hurt either
Alchemy 22(probably). Though you get 14 "for free" (train+book+rings), and that already gives you +2 to hit/damage/element and +14 armor, I think the 8 points are worth it for +3 to hit/damage/element and +21 armor. Invisibility potions are super and make tough fights a piece of cake. Alchemy can also cure poison and disease so you if you're tight on spell slots you can skip learning Detox and Cure ailment.

[Jumping Jack]

Depends on your class, Spotted Shroom. In this case as a healer/paladin type, I agree, but for a Ranger, Dex and Con are the two most important stats.

How do you figure? Both are going to give you small skill boosts, but skill points are much easier to come by than stat points. I've never boosted Dexterity or Concentration for my rangers, only Strength, Endurance, or Perception.

For a ranger, dexterity should be useful. This is, in theory. (Haven't played it as I don't usually play archer-types. )

For every five points, Dexterity gives +1 armor and to hit and damage with bows and piercing weapons(armor=(dex+spd)/5, to-hit=(dex+con)/5). You don't need much strength for piercing weapons and bows are under 10.0 too I think, so easy to handle with Ogre strength.

You can start with 15 in endurance and 35 in perception(roll 14 for each), then just one point and two rings gives a perception of 42 so a decent mana regen for buffs and healing, and keeping up ogre strength to carry and wear your (light) equipment. Rolling also wisdom 11(+1 Emayu) lets you boost wisdom to 20 for learning ogre strength.

Pretty much all other statpoints can go to dexterity. Finishing at lvl 21, 20 levelups gives 59 points to dexterity so should give +12 armor, to hit and damage, which along with alchemy-buffed weapons and armor would go a long way to reach to-hit 41 and armor 85 for 99% to hit and 1% to get hit (http://www.basiliskgames.com/forums/vie ... =12&t=3773)

Theory minmaxing yeah, but a couple points in Wis&Str for early-game convenience still lets you get a major boost by putting 50 points in dex.

Also look at this viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4720

Of course you can boost perception to 70, elemental to 31, cast invisibilty for -90% enemy to-hit and abyssal freeze, fireball etc. enemies to death but then you're a mage and not a ranger