Cartography Skill Table

[Evnissyen]

In case anyone's interested: this is what I've found so far, for cartography:

1 point: trees & walls, all else is blank
2 points: green trees , all else is blank
3 points: major objects & signs , fences(?) , random objects(?) , all else is filled
4 points: metallic walls
5 points: indoor floors , major pathways , roads , water and shallows , barrels(?) , broken barrels and [located] secret compartments
6 points: doors
7 points: minor pathways , all outdoor tiles, beaches , random shorelines , barren lands , dead grass , tunnels/dirt
8 points: no change
9 points: no change
10 points: levers & random shorelines (the latter have changed from dark to lighter brown)
11 points: no change
12 points: treasure chests and bureaus
13 points: ¿?
14 points: torches and explosive barrels
15 points: ¿?
16 points: NPC's appear red with black borders

Note: Though I've made an educated guess on where to place them: fences and random objects appear with either 3 or 4 points; barrels appear with either 5 or 6 points. If anyone can pinpoint these, please let me know.

Thanks to IJBall for his assistance.

If anybody knows about any other items not listed: please add to the list.

[Kreador Freeaxe]

I know Cartography useful changes max out at 17, when you begin to see nearby lifeforms on the minimap before they're in visible range in the game window. At that point chests and loot bags are bright yellow. Broken barrels are purple (this starts at 6 I think).

One thing I keep meaning to mention is that the charting on the minimap seems to be offset by two or three squares from the viewable area in the game window. You can see things on the left and bottom of the game window before the minimap maps them, and it maps things along the top and right before you can see them.

[IJBall]

Hey, Evnissyen - could you please retitle this topic "Cartography Skill Table", to keep it consistent with Book I's Cartography Skill Table topic (i.e. this makes forum searching easier)?

Thanks!

[Evnissyen]

IJ:
Done. Thanks for letting me know.

Kreador:
Yeah, I don't see much value moving up past 7. It's nice to be able to see enemies on your minimap before you run into them (of course, I have no idea how a person would be able to map out moving enemies... must involve some sort of magic)... but those extra 10 points needed to get there could be better spent elsewhere, in my opinion... assuming I don't find any trainers (who charge too much anyhow) who'll train me at this level, or any teaching tomes like in Book 1 that'll raise my skill (and to be honest: I don't even remember if those books did or did not teach you, like the trainers, only up to a certain level)... .

Well, whatever I find: I'll be better equipped to make better strategic decisions if I make a second run through, which is likely, actually, once I get through the frustration of figuring the game out.

The first time is always the hardest.

[IJBall]

IJ:
Done. Thanks for letting me know.

Danke!

In Book I, Level 9 in Cartography made doors green, but I see from your table that in Book II that happens at Level 7.

In Book I, the next Cart. "effect" was chests showing up as "gold" dots at Level 12 - my guess is that in Book II, Level 9 or 10 will either turn chests "gold", or at the least might turn torches and such "orange" (or possibly that's when barrels and such may start showing up as different colors...).

So I'd check for those changes around Level 9 or 10...

[Kreador Freeaxe]

Between trainer and book, you can get to 10 without spending any skill points on Cartography (trainers can teach you to level 8 in Book II, and books add 2 levels whenever you find them).

At 10, chests and barrels and such still show up as brown, though barrels that you've broken open show up as purple.

I know at higher levels explosive barrels show up as red, torches in sconces show up as orange, though standing torches just show up as brown obstacles.

I've always thought of it more as if you're keeping a map in your head, with a semi-magical process (of course, how you can remember an extraordinarily detailed map when you can't recognize a fish, I don't know). It keeps me from worrying about the fact that temporarily raised Cartography level maps get overwritten with worse maps if you go back through the area with lower skill.

[IJBall]

In case anyone's interested: this is what I've found so far, for cartography:

5 points: indoor floors (grey), roads (grey), major pathways (brown), water (blue) and shallows (green)
6 points: doors (bright green)
7 points: minor pathways (brown), all outdoor tiles (brown), beaches & barren lands (brown -- in Book 1 these were beige, but not so in Book 2 apparently, oh well)

I notice that, by Level 7 Cartography at least, while barrels are brown, they appear to show up as a lighter brown (i.e. tan) color than things like walls or rocks/mountains.

So, by Level 7 (or before?...), it looks like barrels are uniquely distinguishable from other objects...

[IJBall]

At 10, chests and barrels and such still show up as brown, though barrels that you've broken open show up as purple.

'Loot' sacks are showing up for me as purple (really more like "plum"! ) as of Level 7 Cartography, so that change may happen earlier than Level 10...

[Evnissyen]

Both noted. I'll take a look at the loot sacks, and I'll also try to pay more attention to those lighter brown objects which signify something, but... not always completely sure what. I've been sensing that these have been a little too random to really make note of.

List updated, as you can see. Now in full technicolor! Added the broken barrels and hidden compartments as well.

Unfortunately I wasn't able to find a darker grey, oh well.

[IJBall]

5 points: indoor floors, major pathways, roads, water and shallows, broken barrels and [located] secret compartments
6 points: doors
7 points: minor pathways, all outdoor tiles, beaches & barren lands

Nice!!

One interesting thing I've discovered with my Level 7 Cartography Fighter - loot sacks do show up as plum/purple, but not in Amireth!! (I say: "Huh?!!")

For some reason, loot sacks won't show up in Amireth - I don't know if it's because the ground gets colored in as dark brown or what, but my loot sacks only showed up as plum/purple in Mistfell (for sure) and Nor'land (I think, but am not sure).

(And I may have a version of this character that I can play around with Cartography with, so I may have a shot at looking at Level 10+ in Cartography. Stay tuned...)

P.S. Evnissyen - it's probably better to note these as Levels rather than "points".

[Painted Lady]

There is one cartography change in Book II between levels 7 and 9 - at level 9 the lava fields turn red.

[IJBall]

There is one cartography change in Book II between levels 7 and 9 - at level 9 the lava fields turn red.

I can confirm that lava's not red at Level 7!

[Evnissyen]

There is one cartography change in Book II between levels 7 and 9 - at level 9 the lava fields turn red.

I guess I'm heading off to the Coppervein Rift, then!

With all this talk, today, about not knowing where to go next, I'm glad to have an objective. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction, Painted Lady!

...Unless that Rift doesn't have any lava underneath it. ...Then I won't know where I'll find lava, unless at some point I end up traveling down to Crakamir or Amireth sometime soon... not likely, methinks.

I do remember the Great Rift, in Book 1, was like a Grand Canyon filled with little mountains until you went underground -- somehow you managed to go really, really, really deep underground in order to get underneath those mountains which were pretty deep down there in that rift -- and then you passed over a bridge and there was all lava underneath. I'd suppose the same thing is done in Book 2. Putting the lava under a mountain range, though, makes more sense, if I have my geology right, since this tells me that lava forms when one plate runs over another, not when plates separate.

So... the Farrock Range and the Forsaken Coast are much, much closer to my travel points... while the Rift would be quite a walk.

¡¡Painted Lady?!! ¿Where can I find some lava??!

[slm]

Purely hypothetically of course , if I were to use ArtMoney or a hex editor the first thing I would do is raise my Cartography skill. Not having a nice automap annoys the heck out of me. If I could make one change to the game it would be to just supply the darn automap from the very beginning.

[Rowanas]

It's the only skill that's non-negotiable at start. If I wanted to min/max, I wouldn't buy it until I had purchased 8 levels from the dude in Kuudad and read the book, but I can't stand having an automap, so it's 3 points to start every time.